When 'In-Office Culture' Meets Zoom: Helgi Walker's View From Gibson Dunn
The leader of Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher's administrative and regulatory team explores new challenges amid the coronavirus outbreak, and how the hallmarks of successful advocacy haven't changed.
April 28, 2020 at 03:04 PM
11 minute read
The original version of this story was published on National Law Journal
In normal times, the law firm Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher maintains what Helgi Walker calls a "strong in-office culture," with lawyers favoring in-person meetings over teleconferences.
"I think a lot of firms do a lot of working from home as a regular matter," said Walker, a Gibson Dunn partner who leads the firm's administrative law and regulatory practice group. "But we have an in-office culture because we think it's important to be there together, to just see each other and bounce ideas off of each other."
It is a culture that routinely brings former Supreme Court clerks and onetime top government officials into the same room. But even as the coronavirus outbreak has upended everyday life, ushering in widespread layoffs and office closures, Walker has found herself in distinguished company working from home in the Georgetown neighborhood of Northwest Washington. At her side, and frequently in her lap, is her tri-color papillon: Cache-Cache.
Cache-CacheThe toy French spaniel was the 36th-ranked papillon in the country at the peak of his show career, she said. On neighborhood strolls, the dog—whose name means "hide and seek" in French—has a way of upstaging his Walker.
"He's pretty famous in Georgetown. You can go on a walk with him and people will say, 'Oh, is that Cache-Cache?'" said Walker, a former clerk for Justice Clarence Thomas who served as a White House lawyer during the George W. Bush administration.
"Most people recognize me by my dog."
Walker recently spoke with The National Law Journal as part of an occasional series looking at how leading lawyers have navigated the many challenges raised by the coronavirus crisis. From her garden room, where she has worked at a cherry federal secretary desk inherited from her grandmother, Walker shared insights about how lawyers have begun to adapt to court arguments held over the telephone.
On Tuesday, for instance, Walker plans to question Gibson Dunn partner Orin Snyder in a moot court hearing, playing the role of judge as her colleague prepares to argue for Jerry Seinfeld in the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit. The mock hearing will be held over Zoom, she said.
"If you think about what a moot court is supposed to be, it's a dress rehearsal. So if you're having a virtual argument, you really should have a virtual moot. That format will best help the advocate deal with the actual forum," Walker said.
The following Q&A has been edited for length and clarity.
NLJ: These have obviously been strange, tragic times. Going into work and traveling is out the window for now. What has the adjustment been like for you?
Walker: Work-wise, appellate lawyers don't travel that much, in general. I think for the appellate lawyers, and our appellate practice group at Gibson Dunn, we've been working as usual. We have not missed a beat in our client services, and we're all really proud of that. With appellate lawyers, we're generally working on briefs, and it's only the rare occasion, relatively speaking, that we travel for an argument. It has not been that great of a shock. Obviously, we miss seeing everybody in person. We've addressed that by having Zoom meetings for our practice group in D.C. and nationally and with the associates, just really using those virtual conference apps to connect and stay connected. It's been a really great way to stay connected with folks. We make a conscious effort to really do that. At Gibson Dunn, we have a culture of being very personally close to begin with. And I think this has made us all even closer.
The thing I think, really, is most crucial to why we've been able to keep serving our clients the way we have is the fact that we have an unbelievable staff at the firm. They have been going into the office on an essential basis to keep things running—the mail room, IT support, all those things that are the lifeblood of a law firm. We have an incredibly dedicated and conscientious and brave staff that has been working so hard during this. None of the lawyers could do any of what we do without them.
What have you found to be the biggest challenges, professionally speaking, in this time?
It's the more mundane things. I wish I had my two big monitors. Writing briefs on a laptop is not ideal, but that is a really small problem in the scheme of things. We're just staying optimistic and positive and getting it done, doing what needs to be done under these circumstances and coming together, knowing that there's a lot of people who are facing much harder situations than we are across the country.
In some ways, I'm more productive because you don't have the commute time to the office. And, look, for litigators, even pre-COVID, there was no real dividing line between 9 to 5 and the rest of your day, or your in-office time and your time at home, because we are service professionals in a fast-paced litigation environment. I think being at home all the time blurs those lines, to the extent there ever were any, even more. So it's like, "Well, you might as well keep working because you're still home. There's still stuff to be done." I've tried to keep a schedule and my same routine, and that's helped.
Of course, courts have had to respond to this crisis as well. How do you feel about the transition to telephone arguments? What do you see as the challenges of that format?
I have not had a virtual argument yet, but many of my partners at the firm have. I think what we've learned from those experiences is that, once again, the clerk's offices are the real heroes. The clerk's offices have been just fantastic in terms of setting up the technology, coordinating the lawyers, coordinating the court, making sure everything works and is synchronized and ready to go. Holding test runs and so forth. The clerk offices have just been exemplary in putting these virtual arguments together.
There was a little bit of a transition period, but I think it's very smooth now. Like anything in life, there are pluses and minuses. But you don't have to travel for the arguments, you can sleep in your own bed and not worry about your flight being canceled and whether you're going to make it or not.
On the other hand, for me at least, an appellate argument is always about the substance but a lot of it is about the EQ—the emotional [intelligence] quotient. Reading body language, watching a judge's facial expression, processing all of those cues in real time to know where you want to go next, where you might want to back off. I think, obviously, we lose that important human interactive ability. But at the end of the day, I think everyone is adjusting, accommodating.
I've heard from some lawyers that the telephonic hearings open up some advantages, like being able to look at notes and not having to focus on making eye contact with a judge or panel of judges. Some have even noted the possibility of having colleagues message you in real time. Do you see any potential advantages for lawyers arguing over the phone?
I actually do not view that as an advantage, because I think any argument, whether it's in person or real time, should be a true dialogue with the court. You really have that conversation with the judges, you have to be 100% concentrating on what they are saying.
And even when I'm doing an in-person argument, I prefer not to have people pass me notes unless it's an emergency situation, because it distracts you and it interrupts your thought process. You have to be 100% engaged with those judges and listening to what they are saying. And, personally, even if I were doing a virtual argument, I wouldn't check my notes, wouldn't want to be texting with people and so on. I think that would actually detract from my effectiveness rather than help it. But that's a personal style thing. I just think, whether it's in person or virtual, you're going to give the most effective argument when you're listening and focusing 100% on what the judges are saying.
Good appellate advocacy is not just about what you say, it's also how good of a listener you are. You have to listen to the judges. As Judge [David] Sentelle famously said to a lawyer who wasn't listening to him, "We are the deciders, and I suggest you answer the questions that we are interested in." He dressed down the lawyer, but he gave incredible practical advice: Listen to the judges, answer their questions. And if you're texting or referring to your notes or thinking about something else while they were talking, you're going to miss what's important to them.
On the agency side, have you been in touch with government officials much? How do you think they've made the transition to this new normal?
I think they're doing a great job adjusting to work-from-home. I haven't had any direct communications, but our schedules for filings are on track. I have spoken to the general counsel of the FCC a few times, and we just talk on our cellphones. We filed at the Supreme Court a cert petition in the media ownership cases coming out of the Third Circuit, and the government also filed a cert petition. So, I had occasion just to check in with the FCC about those filings. Same as ever, we were just talking on cellphones.
The widespread expectation is that agencies and courts will, like so many of us, be slowed down in their work. What long-term effect do you see that having on litigation?
Right now there are fewer district court judgments coming out of the system because the district courts kind of put things on hold. But I feel like the adjustment process is pretty well concluded, and things are going to start up again. I think we may wind up with more litigation and more appeals than we had before because of pent-up demand and because of just the issues that will be presented by the government's response and other governments' responses to the pandemic.
On a lighter note, have you discovered a good show, movie or book? What have you done for diversion?
This is pretty nerdy, but I went through my bookshelves to find something to read that I hadn't read yet. I pulled out Ben Bradlee's "A Good Life." That's kind of a fun Washington read.
This content has been archived. It is available through our partners, LexisNexis® and Bloomberg Law.
To view this content, please continue to their sites.
Not a Lexis Subscriber?
Subscribe Now
Not a Bloomberg Law Subscriber?
Subscribe Now
NOT FOR REPRINT
© 2024 ALM Global, LLC, All Rights Reserved. Request academic re-use from www.copyright.com. All other uses, submit a request to [email protected]. For more information visit Asset & Logo Licensing.
You Might Like
View AllThese Law Firm Leaders Are Optimistic About 2025, Citing Deal Pipeline, International Business
6 minute read‘A Force of Nature’: Littler Mendelson Shareholder Michael Lotito Dies At 76
3 minute readRemembering Am Law 100 Firm Founder and 'Force of Nature' Stephen Cozen
5 minute readLegal Departments Gripe About Outside Counsel but Rarely Talk to Them
4 minute readLaw Firms Mentioned
Trending Stories
- 1Call for Nominations: Elite Trial Lawyers 2025
- 2Senate Judiciary Dems Release Report on Supreme Court Ethics
- 3Senate Confirms Last 2 of Biden's California Judicial Nominees
- 4Morrison & Foerster Doles Out Year-End and Special Bonuses, Raises Base Compensation for Associates
- 5Tom Girardi to Surrender to Federal Authorities on Jan. 7
Who Got The Work
Michael G. Bongiorno, Andrew Scott Dulberg and Elizabeth E. Driscoll from Wilmer Cutler Pickering Hale and Dorr have stepped in to represent Symbotic Inc., an A.I.-enabled technology platform that focuses on increasing supply chain efficiency, and other defendants in a pending shareholder derivative lawsuit. The case, filed Oct. 2 in Massachusetts District Court by the Brown Law Firm on behalf of Stephen Austen, accuses certain officers and directors of misleading investors in regard to Symbotic's potential for margin growth by failing to disclose that the company was not equipped to timely deploy its systems or manage expenses through project delays. The case, assigned to U.S. District Judge Nathaniel M. Gorton, is 1:24-cv-12522, Austen v. Cohen et al.
Who Got The Work
Edmund Polubinski and Marie Killmond of Davis Polk & Wardwell have entered appearances for data platform software development company MongoDB and other defendants in a pending shareholder derivative lawsuit. The action, filed Oct. 7 in New York Southern District Court by the Brown Law Firm, accuses the company's directors and/or officers of falsely expressing confidence in the company’s restructuring of its sales incentive plan and downplaying the severity of decreases in its upfront commitments. The case is 1:24-cv-07594, Roy v. Ittycheria et al.
Who Got The Work
Amy O. Bruchs and Kurt F. Ellison of Michael Best & Friedrich have entered appearances for Epic Systems Corp. in a pending employment discrimination lawsuit. The suit was filed Sept. 7 in Wisconsin Western District Court by Levine Eisberner LLC and Siri & Glimstad on behalf of a project manager who claims that he was wrongfully terminated after applying for a religious exemption to the defendant's COVID-19 vaccine mandate. The case, assigned to U.S. Magistrate Judge Anita Marie Boor, is 3:24-cv-00630, Secker, Nathan v. Epic Systems Corporation.
Who Got The Work
David X. Sullivan, Thomas J. Finn and Gregory A. Hall from McCarter & English have entered appearances for Sunrun Installation Services in a pending civil rights lawsuit. The complaint was filed Sept. 4 in Connecticut District Court by attorney Robert M. Berke on behalf of former employee George Edward Steins, who was arrested and charged with employing an unregistered home improvement salesperson. The complaint alleges that had Sunrun informed the Connecticut Department of Consumer Protection that the plaintiff's employment had ended in 2017 and that he no longer held Sunrun's home improvement contractor license, he would not have been hit with charges, which were dismissed in May 2024. The case, assigned to U.S. District Judge Jeffrey A. Meyer, is 3:24-cv-01423, Steins v. Sunrun, Inc. et al.
Who Got The Work
Greenberg Traurig shareholder Joshua L. Raskin has entered an appearance for boohoo.com UK Ltd. in a pending patent infringement lawsuit. The suit, filed Sept. 3 in Texas Eastern District Court by Rozier Hardt McDonough on behalf of Alto Dynamics, asserts five patents related to an online shopping platform. The case, assigned to U.S. District Judge Rodney Gilstrap, is 2:24-cv-00719, Alto Dynamics, LLC v. boohoo.com UK Limited.
Featured Firms
Law Offices of Gary Martin Hays & Associates, P.C.
(470) 294-1674
Law Offices of Mark E. Salomone
(857) 444-6468
Smith & Hassler
(713) 739-1250