Inside the White House, Donald McGahn personally took part in episodes Special Counsel Robert Mueller III scrutinized as part of an investigation into whether President Donald Trump sought to obstruct the Russia investigation. Outside the White House, he has found himself in litigation with the House, resisting a subpoena for his testimony in the impeachment process.

It has all made McGahn, the former White House counsel, among the most fascinating figures in the Trump era.

On Thursday, in rare public remarks, McGahn steered clear of the drama that has swirled around him, instead speaking broadly about his view of the White House counsel's role while recounting the occasional arm-twisting that came with congressional dealings, including his aggressive quest to shape the federal judiciary.